Yeah, some of us have been ordering and modifying frames for decades. After you read this you’ll understand why many builders stick with the same frame manufacturer and configuration forever. I’m writing this, because I recently faced this dilemma while ordering a frame from Paughco. I picked up the phone, asked for a rigid and the questions started flying: How much rake, stretch, where, tubing thickness, oil bag, what engine, what neck, how wide, offset, what transmission, single downtube, etc? I didn’t know which way to turn?
Recently I ran into Travis and Don Richard from Xtreme Cycle Design, in Orange County, and they sent me an ordering sheet to review. Then I spoke to Don about the ordering process. All their frames are made to order. “We try to hold the customer’s hand through the ordering process,” Don said. They make basically two styles of frames, Chopper (Softail or rigid) or Pro-Street (which is still a Softail frame but low and long). “Often customers see a bike on our web site and point to it for ordering help,” Don added.
So we got started on the elements that must be decided to order a frame:
Rake
Stretch (down tubes and back bone—up and out)
Single or dual rail downtubes
Gussets or stress bar or both or none
Type of neck (with or without fork cups)
Gas Tanks mounts
Seat mounts
Tubing type and size
Foot controls
Frame width
Engine style or size
Transmission offset, style
Coil bungs
Top motormount
Rear brake mounts
Oil bag mounts
Axle Size
Wishbone
Drop seat
Fork stops
That’s the basics. Now we’ll add some thought processes. Depending on the manufacturer you choose, you may have more options. Let’s start with the rake and handling characteristics. Xtreme frames come with a rake from 30 to 55 degrees. Your first consideration could be riding style or plans for the bike. If it’s a show bike go for the 55 degree rake for outlandish appearance or 32 degrees for a wild bobber. If you want a rideable scoot Don recommends no more than 40 degrees. My last Paughco frame was 35 degrees in the neck and three in the Paughco springer. I love the way it handles.
Here’s an odd question to ask yourself. If you want the bike to be a long distance freeway flier, then 40 plus degrees is cool. But the more you rake that puppy the less cornering capabilities you’ll have. You can offset that with raked triple trees, but most builders consider 4 inches of trail to be ideal, so keep that in mind. Also the longer the front end the wilder it looks, but the more unruly it handles.Moving right along, stretch is next. Don recommends 3 inches out (backbone) and 1-inch up is an ideal Pro-Street Configuration. It’s all up to you. My Paughco is four up and three out, for a frame that almost fits a 240 pound, 6’5” monster. I like the stretch and this bike is still tight. Extreme builds frame as tall as 8 up and out. When they’re stretched that much, you can expect a great deal of flex at speeds. Don suggested my formula of 3 out and 4 up with a 12 over front end. “It’s not radical,” Don said, “but has that cool chopper look.” My Paughco springer was 9 inches over stock. That’s another tough one to figure out sometimes. That term Over can mean over-stock wide glide, early springer, late springer, narrow glide, etc? I believe we have an article from Custom Cycle Engineering on tube lengths and how to figure them out, in our tech section.
Now that you have the rake, and stretch measurement figured out, think about the neck style. There’s the hour glass neck that uses the old style fork cups with races already installed. Or there’s the straight neck that you must install bearing races into.
Next, think about the neck gussets. Stock frames generally come with a stress bar between the top motormount and the bottom of the neck for addition strength. If you’re going to ride the snot out of a bike, especially if the front end is heavy and extended (leverage against the neck area) you may want to consider keeping the stress bar in place. Also think about the gas tank shape. If it will cover the stress bar, might as well leave it. Also the stress bars can be used to house electrics between it, the backbone and the tank halves.
Xtreme offers the stress (or country bar), a neck gusset to replace the bar and support the neck, or both. If you’re running a tank along the top of the backbone, you may want to remove the stress bar and use a gusset.
Let’s kick the gas tank business around. It’s a major consideration. If riding plans include hauling ass across country or to Sturgis, you need to consider gas capacity. Then there’s a myriad of tank styles and positions. There’s a mounting system for each configuration. Xtreme builds tanks and if you go with one of theirs, they will install the tank tabs. Or if you’re going to run stock tanks, they have the mounts. If you mount them yourself, consider the distance from the triple trees for turning and not denting the tanks.
Some frame manufactures offer a variety of tubing styles and sizes. Xtreme offers 1 1/8 tubing for all of their 180-240 rear tire frames and 1 ¼-inch on their 280-300 frames. You can special order a frame with either tubing. It’s a major consideration for the overall look of the bike and frame strength.
Since new bikes are equipped with 1-inch axles, they are also a consideration. If you are purchasing new custom wheels, make sure the wheel bearings match the axle configuration you choose. Big engines and larger axles make a lot of sense.
Foot controls are next. If you like the forward loop of the frame to remain clean, you might consider mid controls. If you’re 6’4”, forward controls might be more appealing. If you love cornering through snake like bends, mid controls might be the way to go and more companies are making mid control systems. Think about it before you place your frame order.
Seat styles make a difference. Xtreme frames generally come with the traditional loop for a seat tongue. They will also mount the rear fender solid to the frame. If you plan to run a sprung seat, you might ask about a pivot mount and rear spring bungs.
”Customers rarely want coil mounts anymore,” Don said. Most builders hide the coils now and handle that themselves, but it’s a consideration. Xtreme offers stock coil mounts.
Brakes are another consideration. I like the Softail style tab and try to put the caliper between the frame rails. But there’s a multitude of styles including the Exile style on the left side with a chain. It’s time to think about the size of the tire, whether you’re going to run your pulley and brake together, on opposite sides, chain, narrow belt or stock belt.
According to Don 280-300 tire sizes equate to more costly frames. Here’s the offset dope: 240-250 tire frames come with 1 5/8 tranny offset and ½-inch motor offset. A 250 must run a chain or 1 1/8-inch belt. The 240 can run a standard belt.
It’s a different, but better ballgame for the 280-300 tires since they require a right-side drive transmission so you can run a full sized belt every time and the driveline is centered.
Xtreme also offers splash guard tabs for Softail frames, if you don’t go with a full solid mounted fender. All their frames come with axles, flush mounted axle covers, pivot bolts and shaft for their swingarm, axle adjusters, primary spacer, integrated motormounts and tranny plate. All of their Softail configured frames come with their oil tanks that are custom fitted to their chassis.
Engine clearance is a consideration in two directions. If you have a monster Evo engine above 124 inches, you may have a clearance issue. Xtreme can radius the backbone for more clearance. On the other hand, if you’re running a traditional Knuckle or Pan, you may be faced with too much clearance and the backbone needs to sweep closer over the engine for the proper look.
Now for some oddball considerations. Like I mentioned above you may need the backbone radius, or how about a drop seat style or wishbone down tubes. Fork stops need to be thought out. All Xtreme frames come with external stops. Xtreme also offers mounted gas tanks, mounted rear fenders, molded necks, molded gas tanks to seat area (stretched), molded seat to fender area, molded flush under gas tank to frame and molded fenders to swingarms.
Lots to think about when ordering a frame, but hopefully this will give you a check list. I want to thank Don at Xtreme Cycle Design in Orange County, Ron at Paughco and Kent Weeks at Lucky Devil for sharing their insights. Below is a Lucky Devil Frame ordering form. Kent only makes one-off custom frames or modifies anything from stock to custom. He’s based in Houston.
XTREME FRAMES
1030 W Collins Ave.
Orange, CA 92867-5539
Phone: (714) 628-1855
Fax: (714) 628-1857
Tubing Size : 1 1/8” ___________ 1 ¼” __________ 1 3/8”___________ (check one box)
Rigid ______________________
Softail ______________________
Rake ______________________
Forward Stretch ______________
Upward Stretch ______________
Tire Size ____________________
Steering Neck Style: Hourglass ____________ Straight ______________ (check one box)
Hidden Fork Stops ____________
Single Down Tube ____________
Dual Down Tube _____________
Engine Style _________________
All 240 and 250 Frames are supplied with a 1” axel unless otherwise specified
* S&S 124” Motor requires more clearance *** WE MUST KNOW***
Any Extra points in the frame or motor mount
Any other changes or items NOT NEEDED
___________________________
ONLY ONE FRAME PER ORDER PAGE
VIN # IF NEEDED
________________________________________________
